Any info on Cavalier King Charles please! Questions

Hi, we have a cocker spaniel (she is a young 12 years) and we recently lost our other cocker back in May (PTS).
We have been looking for a rescue dog and could'nt decide what breed (we want a small dog).Our last two cockers were from breeders and had temperament problems etc. but the one we have now is lovely, so sweet and will easily accept another dog.
Last week a strange thing happened - a lady in our village turned up on the doorstep with a lost Cavalier Spaniel so we took him in for a while until the owner arrived. We absolutely fell in love with him, such a dear little fellow and so easy going and friendly!
As you can probably guess we are smitten and would love to have one of our own.
Just wondered if anyone who is an experienced Cav owner can give some information about aquiring a puppy as a PET, we can't afford show dog prices! I want to know about the heart problems which seem quite common and do we have to see a vets certicate for the parents health?
Our last cocker had diabetus for the last 2 years of his life and we had to nurse him back to full health, he died at 12 years. We feel he inherited this from inbreeding, as we never fed him anything sweet etc. and he had loads of excerise, so he should have been a healthy dog. We just don't want to go through a lot of health problems with a new puppy again.
Any info would be greatly appreciated. Thank you!

My first dog was a Cav, his name was Buster. He was a beautiful loving loyal lap dog, perfectly marked to the point we were asked frequently to sire him. We never did. The reason his perfect Cav looks also came with the typical cav problems. He had poor breathing, his heart problems were awful and he also had problems with his leg. He sadly passed away aged 8 due to his heart complications (RIP Bu Bu's)

We wouldnt own the breed again despite them being such wonderful dogs because of all of his health problems. It cost a fortune and was not pleasant to see in his later years.

Definitly ask about health tests and vet checks.

If you have any question about his prolems in more depth dont hesitate to give me a shout. They are such lovely dogs. My mum will never get over losing him, he was her little boy.

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A neighbour has them. The male is very yappy towards other dogs. She never lets them off lead as they have zero recall.
Other than that they are nice dogs and friendly around people.
They seem healthy dogs and I have lived here eight years and she had them when I moved in, so they are over eight.

You will need to see evidence of heart and eye testing and that the parents have been MRI scanned too.

The fact is that mostly the only breeders doing the full health checks are show breeders, and the price you are paying is to ensure your puppy has been given the best chance for a healthy life. MRI scans are very pricey, and the price of puppies does reflect that.

Cavalier puppies that are being sold for low prices should be ringing alarm bells. They are most likely from untested parents and that is not something you want to risk with the CKCS.

Other than their health problems, they are gorgeous little dogs with bags of character. They should be easily trained and they love absolutely everyone!

From what I know it is very difficult to find breeders who DO all the relevant and appropriate health tests.
A massive amount of Cavaliers have heart problems, epilepsy is also a serious concern.

A good breeder will definitely be required and a pup will NOT be cheap as decent breeders will have spent a lot on all the testing required. Don't go for a cheap option unless you wish for a lifetime of worry, uncertainty and canine ill health

My good friend got hers the same time we got Vito, and I have never met a yappier dog! How their neighbours cope I don't know- he barks at the wind blowing leaves

His neighbour has two, a dog and a bitch, the dog is yappy the bitch isn't- I know thats a very small sample of the breed but I wouldn't have one after knowing theirs- even though he is a lovely friendly wee thing!

Their dog doesn't have recall either but thats possibly due to a lack of training.

My experience of Cavaliers is that they can be vocal-but only in excitement not aggression & never towards other dogs & always for a reason. Having lived with Cavaliers since the early 1990s all mine do have a recall, but that is because like all my other dogs they are trained.

They are much more spaniel than "toy" mine like nothing better than to go hunting in the garden after mice & I know that they would love to be able to flush & retrieve birds-they often flush birds out in the gardem-one has a passion for errant ducks who decide to visit my garden.

To pay a low amount of money for a"pet"is very much a false economy. The "pet"breeders do not do any of the important health tests & disregard all the advice available to breed healthier dogs. they breed from dogs & bitches way too yound, no Cavalier should be bred from under 2 1/2 years of age & the older the grandparents of the puppies are the better.

Our youngest Cavalier is from bloodlines known to be long lived & the parents & grand parents are all MRI scanned normal as well as having clear hearts & eyes. Roodee's father is well over 5 years of age & Roodee did not come from a "show"breeder, but someone with a passion for the breed, who breeds to the breed standard & does all essential health tests. He wasn't cheap at £700 but was/is worth every single penny-mind you I have also seen Border Collies for sale from health tested parents at the same price !

Buster never ever barked but he was the horniest dog Ive ever owned out of my intact males! lol. What about a "Cavapoo" Cav and poodle cross? Essentially the same however they tend to be non moulting and due to being a cross breed reduces the likelihood of typical pedigree health issues. Although I would still look for health certificates from both parents of the puppy. Believe they are less expensive as well atm as they are not as desired as other "designer" breeds like the Labradoodle and the cockerpoo.

L

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Hi and thanks for all your help. Its interesting to know how owners of cavaliers have found them to be. After reading my dog books they allsay they are not a yappy kind of dog!
I got the impression they were quite easy going, reasonably calm sort of dogs. Certainly the one who came to see us the other day was!
I do understand that good breeders charge a lot for their pups because of the health checks, but I thought it was because of their high pedigree. I thought that they were cheaper from private homes because of a lack of high pedigree? Not all breeders do these health checks and still charge a fortune!

I don't but into this hybrid vigour thing any more. It's unlikely as well that you would find crossbreeds with tested parents. Adding poodle into the mix could push the energy levels up through the roof, as poodles are high energy dogs. I come across a lot of Cavs in my job and although they are vocal little dogs, they are also trainable and so the noise can be controlled. I find they are generally very sweet dogs and as Joedee says, more spaniel than toy. They are generally less highly strung that the other spaniel types. If you want a Cav it's best to save up and get one with all the relevant tests on the parents. A cheap Cav may cost you thousands in the long term and also it's very upsetting to have a poorly dog of course. I don't think £700 is expensive for a well bred dog. You could pay that for a Cav x on many a website!

These designer mongrels are usually more expensive that correctly bred pedigree dogs. I've yet to find a single Cavalier cross that has had the MRI scan done on the Cavalier parent & no cavalier should be bred from without having been MRI scanned first.

As for non moulting Urban legend believe me.

Mixing dog breeds does not lead to "hybrid"vigour either

Sorry but this is a very very miss leading post indeed.
You dont know what you will get in a cross bred litter, so cant state they tend to be non moulting, you could get moulting and non moulting in the same litter. If some one is looking for a non moulting breed there are plenty breeds about that dont moult, with out having to have a lucky dip with a cross breed.

Reduces the likelyhood of health issues to is a miss leading, false statement! Breeds are known for health issues yes and breeding to dogs together that have an health issue could result in the off spring having the same problem, let it be pure bred or not.

Poodles and cresteds (for example)! Both suffer some similar eye diseases.
If I mated an a Poodle affected by PRA to an Crested affected by PRA , then the same result will come to the off spring, If I had mated an PRA affacted Poodle, or Cresteds to their own breed.

Its not actually about the breeds being mated
...........Its about the health status of both dogs.. ;-)

Also from my knowlegde and certainly what I have seen most 'designer' cross breeds are more expensive than health tested pure breeds! ...



Cavs are a great breed, I know of some one that shows and breeds them! Can't offer much advice though, as I have'nt personally owned one. Just love grooming and walking them They get on great with ours dogs, even the Italian Spinone! They seem quite clever animals, easy to learn, and always wanting to please - From what I have seen?!

Sounds just like the two I know xxxxxx

TBH I don't know how much she paid for them or who the breeder was but I can tell you she bought litter siblings, a male and a female. The female does not make noise, it is always the male and it is always when dogs go past, I can't even walk my dogs, past his garden (and he is way back gated beyond the drive) without him barking, if he is out. I know the male is a great hunter and kills birds and recently killed a rat (in his garden). They are the red colour , I believe this is called Ruby but the male has elements of cream on him. As I say lovely dogs but a handful for their owner. Of course this could all stem from her having bought the two puppies together.

This is a sad misconception that the general public have been led to by programs like PDE from Jemima Whatername.

Good breeders charge what they consider to be the best amount to ensure that they can go on testing & rearing their dogs to optimum health.

Our Roodee's father isn't a "top showdog"just a very typical healthy Cavalier. Roodee wasn't bred for the showring, he was bred for health & to continue his breeders bloodlines(not that he is going to be bred from)

Think of the costs of a litter

Stud fee-traditionally the cost of a puppy-£500 min. health testing £300 upwards, rearing of the puppies £????, Veterinary fees during preganancy-£100 upwards. £900 + already & if there has to be any emergency treatment-like a C section-anything upwards of £400 to be added.

This is without the time & sundry costs like electricity etc etc

Fine if you get big litters & can sell the puppies easily to good homes, but small litters almost always end in a not inconsiderable loss to the breeder.

I'm just about to order the DNA tests for my new puppy bitch(not a Cavalier)
:CEA, TNS, CL, MDR1.

She will then still need hip & elbow scoring(or PennHip haven't decided yet)as well as the clinical eye test for PRA & Glaucoma

Total cost ????????? In excess of £500 that's for sure.

Even when all this tests are done it doesn't guarantee that I will be able to breed from her !

Definitely not from a good breeder allowing someone to purchase two siblings from one litter

There are many reason that pedigree dog breeders charge what they do. Alot of things refelect the price,

-How common the breed is.
-The lines the dogs are from.
-Some times the showing results of the parents.
-How many breeders, breed the breed in the same area.
-What the avarge price is in that area.
-If the dogs are tested or not, and what for.


Decent breeders are not out to make money or make money back from what was spent out. Just ensure, the find great homes for their well adjusted, healthy puppies! That are an asset to the breed.

Alot of cross breeders play the card 'Its rare' ermm no - a Poodle cross Cocker isnt, a Chinese Crested cross JRT isnt rare. Yada Yada! Anyone can breed two crosses, and get a nice cute litter, that possibly will be great family pets. Does this make it right.. I think not!!
They charge a fortune, do no tests! Not looking at gaining anything from the litter, in an ethical way.. for example to further their breed! They just want a litter and could do with the money I guess. No real reason

None of my post said they are definitly this or that. I said they tend to be non moulting which they do, every F1 poodle cross I have met have been, however I am aware some are not. Its a wildcard mix you never know what you are going to get.

As they are not as closely bred mongrels/crossbreeds are likely to be healthier however of course no one can gaurantee this and of course if the parents are riddled with this that and the next thing the pups are at risk which is why I mentioned still looking for tested parents.

The only reason I suggested a "Cavapoo" is because Twigs mentioned their interest in the breed and after owning a Cav with all the breed associated problems despite paying a fortune for him and tested parents I would hate for someone else to feel the pain we felt in Busters later years and the bomb we had to pay out for him. Just thought it could be an option they may be willing to explore. But of course not all cavs will have the same problems its just a shame from my personal experience they have all been very unhealthy dogs, perhaps just my misfortune.

With more "hybrids" around more breeders are testing there dogs and still at a lower price than their pedigree counterparts. I know this as my mum and dad and my partners mum and sister own cockerpoos who's parents have all been health screened for breed associated problems. However due to demand cockerpoos cost just as much as a Cocker these days. Before the sudden demand they were cheaper.

Totally agree on the energy level of the poodle of course.

Also agree poodle crosses are by no means rare, they're everywhere these days lol

I dont own a "designer" dog I own two mongrels and tbh I dont care what the dog is made up of as long as it is happy and healthy I dont even know what mine are a cross of lol. I have never had any problems with my two but have been misfortunate with the pedigrees I have owned in the past. So I am by no means trying to push the breed, personally I wouldnt own a cockerpoo or a cavapoo but that just me. Im not against pedigrees either, the next dog I plan to own is an RBT

Sorry if any of my previous post was misinterprated. Even if Twigs were to be intrested in a Cav cross im pretty sure they would do theyre own homework rather than a few lines in a post from me

L

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Sorry never realised how much of an essay that was until I posted it lol :O

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Sorry but how many of the Cockers are DNA tested & how many of the Poodles ??

I'm one of those sad people you contact designer mongrel breeders & ask them about DNA testing & to date none have ever known about DNA testing being available let alone bothering to do it

Cockers X Poodles is not widening the gene pool as both have PRA & HD for starters

Haven't seen many"Cocker x poodles" HD scores on the BVA website either.

You see it isn't enough to test the parents of any breed but the offspring need to be tested too.

BTW A Cocker x Poodle will not have the same characteristics as a Cavalier

Ive had Cavaliers for 16 years and absolutely adore them, I will always be a Cavalier person. However Alfie will be my last one This might be a bit long.

Regarding barking, I have found that they are only barky if there are noises outside or the doorbell goes, however Alfie has gold KC and is a registered PAT dog and does know 'quiet'

IMHO they are very sweet natured, gentle, loving dogs who are great around children and can be both typical lap dog and love going out for walks. They are generally good around other dogs, and as long as you socialise them properly are bombproof. Alfie doesnt even lift an eyelid at fireworks or me dropping a baking tin . As for recall, Cavvies tend to be very food orientated so Ive never had a recal problem as they genuinely want to be near you and if there is a treat involved then they want to be extra near you lol.

The downsides and the reasons why I wont be having another one are:

Relatively short lived 8-10 years and the biggest cause of their death is heartfailure which is a terrible way to go. My Rosie almost drowned in her own lungs due to the amount of fluid in her body.
They also have eye problems, the biggest being 'dry eye'. My Alfie has this and it involves having to put ointment into his eyes at 12hourly intervals, the 3gram tubes are £25 a shot. They last 4 weeks if you are lucky.

They can also suffer from something called syringomyelia, this is where the skull is deformed putting pressure on the brain and brain stem and causes a lot of pain and awful symptoms which are incurable (hence MRI scans as part of the tests).
They are also prone to putting on weight (and I mean really quickly as well) after being spayed or neutered, and their coat can become candy floss like.

As for finding a decent breeder, you are told to go to one that has had the parents MRI scanned, heart clear certificates at 5yrs old, eye tests done as well........however.........

All three of my Cavvies came from breeders that have had that done, they are listed on all the relevant websites as being decent breeders and I saw and checked out certificates to prove the health tests. I thought I would be okay. My first dog Rosie, died aged 10 from Mitral Valve disease leading to heart failure, she was also showing signs of syringomyelia, my second Cavvie Daisy was from one of the top breeders in the country, and was one of the judges at Crufts for Cavvies, all relevant papers seen and checked out. Daisys papers were going to be sent to us, as she was going to use the name we chose for her in her KC name. It turned out that the litter was never registered, and it turned out out that Daisy has a congenital eye problem. Her breeder refused to answer my calls and we never had any of the promised paperwork sent. My third dog Alfie, different breeder, all tests done etc, Alfie developed dry eye at 18months old.

If you get a cavvie, please ensure that you have lifetime, very comprehensive insurance for at least £5000 per annum per illness. You might need it at some point.