Northern Inuit AI litters Discussions

again your right... but I have seen some jumpy dogs that will not penatrate deep enough for the rear glands at the back of the penis to go in....

As you say though, with experianced breeders, this shouldnt happen,

Its never been a problem with my lot... they are horny gits...lol

I think Greyhawk has a very valid point ref AI and not using it 'ndiscriminantly', Can I ask, why was AI used in this instance? Sorry if this has been covered already, I seem to have missed it, if it has.

No probs Borderdawn I can accept that!

I know a few like that!!

Its just Werewolf kept on about the dog "refusing" to tie, thats a load of rubbish and completely untrue and incorrect.

Thanks, wasnt meaning to sound rude.

How about refused to mate then? Just wondering why the AI was used in the first place?

If he mated her at a later date, it may just be the bitch was not ready,

some times with an unproven dog a novice breeder may not have enough faith to wait a few more days,

Or was it the bitch cos she wasnt ready? Think if you look back that question has already been answered :?

Guess I'm not the only one after all eh

As far as I am concerned the dog is proven, he has mated naturally and sired a live litter so therefore fertile, beit from the mating or AI and should be advertised as such. If there are concerns from the people/person "at the top" then why not put him on as proven but say that AI and a natural mating took place and then leave it to the owners of the bitches to contact the stud owner and let them make up their own minds :?

I am not clear on the reason for urgency.

Thanks Shona, I understand that. IMO (and just that) I just think that nature should take its course and if there is no mating then so beit. Ref AI, I can agree with it in certain circumstances.

Inexperiance of the novice breeder will count for that (no offence meant be that either) - Panic.

As Shona said, if the bitch wasnt ready, he may well of not been intereted. Dont forget males can live with females in season and will not bother at all untill they are spot on ready. other males will go nuts all the time. My friends Dobe male would show no interest at all in the bitches in season except for 2 or 3 days when they were ready, they used him as a marker of when to mate her, worked both times.

My boy is a bit like that, although he dose notice and checks the bitch constantly, whines and paces a bit, but he will not attempt to mate till the bitch is ready and "stands" for him, it helps me to get a good idea of when the bitch maybe ready for the next time, and will therefore tell me exactly when she is ready on the season I plan to have her mated.

It's a bit like having a teaser pony on a stud farm lol

Well, I have asked on this thread more than once why AI was used in the first place and I guess the owner of the stud has missed that, as there has been no answer. (If she comes online tonight perhaps she will answer.) From what I have read, I believe that the dog refused to mate the bitch, AI was used and then at a later stage the dog did then mate the bitch, so it is not clear as to whether the litter is the result of AI or whether it was a result of the 'mating'.

Is it common to use both AI and then let the dog mate the bitch at a later stage? I guess not.

Very knowledgeable post by the way, thank you.

The question (in brief) has been awnsered. Since the thread/topic was to establish whether this method constitiues the dog as proven or not and not whether it was correct to use this method I did not feel it was relevent to post and since you are a member of the other forum and have been posting on the thread there you should already have all these awnsers as I posted them a very long detailed account on there. But for the benefit of everyone I will post again.

Angel (the above mentioned stud) has been put to a bitch prior to this case. He mated this bitch several times with no problems or reluctance, although no litter resulted.

Misty did not have her first season till approx 15 months of age, her following season did not occur until she was almost 3. Using that as a guide had she not been mated at this particular season she would not have come in again until approximatly 4 years of age (which IMO is too old for a first litter) so it was decided that if a litter was not produced this time round she would not be bred.

When Misty came into season Angel showed very little sign of interest (apart from the teeth chattering and licking etc, but no attempting to mount). By day 14 (going off standard text book rules of when to know a bitch is ready) and still no sign of him being interested I was almost sure she must be ready and started to worry I wasn't going to get the mating, it was then suggested to me about using AI so I got a referral to an AI specialist went through the motions of whats involved etc and it was agreed that Misty certantly sounded ready. So on day 16 I went ahead with the AI option, 2 days following Angel suddenly decided he was interested and went on to mate Misty naturally (including a tie).

A litter of 5 was produced from this and was born inbetween the date of AI and the natural mating.

I hope that awnsers your questions.

I cant understand why the dog was allowed to mate naturally AFTER AI? from what I have heard and been told by people that have gone this rout, after care of the bitch is quite important, to ensure success, why risk losing a potential litter? I just dont get it.

Mo

Ahhh I didn't realise it was your litter that was being brought up Kate..things make a little more sense now..

So the stud was with you, and the bitch would'nt stand..then you did AI to make sure of a litter (well a mating technically) then when the dogs were ready they did the deed anyway..so patience would have prevailed if mother nature was given the chance....

IF the previous mating never took it could just be one of those things..could be the bitch..or a mix of the two..

But if he has produced a live litter I would say he is proven..no matter what method was used..(still don't agree with AI unless the dog is dead or overseas...if the bitch don't want to stand for a dog the so be it!)

Yep my litter. Basically yes thats the long n short of it Louise. Thats fine if you don't agree with it we are all entitled to our own opinions. The world would be a boring place if we all agreed on everything.

Like I have said previously I don't claim it was nesisarily the correct way to go about things and maybe I was a little hasty in my desicion but I do not claim to be an experienced breeder this was my first litter and at the time I used the knowledge I had gained from other breeders, text books/written liturature and the information I had before me at the time to make the decision, what has been done cannot be undone, the experience can only now be used as a valueable lesson/learning curb.

Well said and I agree with you