Presa mauls pensioner to death - do we need better controls on who can own one? Controversial

Discussion in 'Presa Canario' started by Azz, Jun 3, 2014.

  1. Azz

    Azz Adminstrator

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    Presa mauls pensioner to death - do we need better controls on who can own one?

    From the news section on Dogsey: http://www.dogsey.com/dog-news.php?t=189712

    A Presa Canario who was not fed or watered adequately for "several hours" mauled a neighbour to death.

    Raising the question of whether we need better controls on who can own such breeds - clearly, large powerful breeds require more experienced or skilled owners. Although some might argue the changes in the dog laws might act as a deterrent, but is there anything else that can be done?
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  3. Trouble

    Trouble Member

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    Faustino and CaroleC like this.
    I don't think large powerful breeds need more experienced owners at all, what I think is they need owners dedicated to the welfare and wellbeing of their dog and it's place in society. How do you become more experienced? An owner who has owned many small dogs may well be an experienced owner but does that make them capable of owning a large or powerful breed? Plenty of first time owners manage just fine with large powerful dogs because the put the effort into the dog rather than thinking they know it all because they've had dogs for years. I think a huge part of the problem is certain breeds simply attract the wrong owners for a variety of reasons.
  4. katygeorge

    katygeorge Member

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    i was a total dimwhit when i got phoebe, didnt have a clue what i was doing and was truely chucked in the deep end. Phoebe could have ended up very bad and naughty. I treated her like all the children ive looked after over the years, firm but fair, turns out Phoebe needed slightly firmer. sadly dogs like this will always attract the bad ones, i get a lot of attention from chavs when im out with Phoebe as they like dogs that make them look "hard" and always asking me questions. I try and put them off as much as possible. Untill more is done on the streets to enforce the dogs laws with an iron fist i dont see much of anything changing and i dont see the money being invested to enforce the laws. Ive reported my neighbour to dog warden 3 times now for having 2 out of control dogs. She just lets them out her front door as im passing and they come out barking at Phoebe and really upsetting her and the owner just laughs and attempts to call her dogs back with no success. Ive filmed it now for dog warden so hope he takes note. Ive also warned this woman that if Phoebe bites her dog and gets put down because of it i will kill her and her stupid dogs. Ive also threatened to let go of Phoebe before now to defend her self but this woman is unreal and doesnt care. Fair enough their "only" spaniels but if my dog needs to be under control then so should hers. Wow bit of a rant there, sorry
  5. GsdSlave

    GsdSlave Member

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    CaroleC likes this.
    Although the story varies, from paper to paper I don’t think not being fed or having water for several hours would cause it to attack, banning people really serves no purpose as all one has to do is move to different area or someone else in household can have dogs, and these bans are not monitored I don’t think only experienced owners owning large breeds is the answer either its more the wrong type of people getting these dogs for the wrong reasons.
    As for what can be done, wish I knew the answer, I personally don’t see that ‘education’ is getting through as its been banded about for years and still these tragedies happen.
    Some people shouldn’t own dogs ‘full stop’.The amendment to DDA is only useful after the event but won’t stop it happening.
  6. Azz

    Azz Adminstrator

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  7. 6JRT's

    6JRT's Member

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    Is this one of the puppies that the security firm had bred from the 2 dogs he imported to England couple years back.
  8. katygeorge

    katygeorge Member

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    just read the last link you posted azz. i hope its a miss print as it list the dog as weighing 5 stone. that cant be right, phoebe weighs 8
  9. Azz

    Azz Adminstrator

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    Don't think so Tina - there's no mention of that in anything I've read..

    I would expect a Presa to be a minimum of 6 or 7 stone
  10. Malka

    Malka Member

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    So if the report was correct and the dog only weighed 5 stone, it sounds like it was not fed properly or sufficiently.

    Katy's Phoebe weighs more than I do.
  11. 6JRT's

    6JRT's Member

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    Presa Canario

    (Perro de Presa Canario) (Dogo Canario) (Canary Dog)

    The Presa Canario has a powerful, square head that is nearly as wide as it is long. The muzzle is broad. The chest is deep and broad. The rump is slightly raised. This breed has thick skin, dense bones, powerful muscles and a massive head with a large jaw. The ears are usually cropped. Colors include fawn and various brindles; white markings are sometimes seen.
    Weight 39 -54 kg (6 - 8 stones) for females - 45 - 64kg (7 - 10 stones) for males
    Height 21 - 24 inches (56 - 64 cm) females - 22 - 25 inches (58 – 66 cm) for males
    DogoCanarioPresaDogToba1Dog12Mohths.jpg






    This is the security firm that breeds & sells these dogs
    www.cuffgroup.co.uk/cuff-security-dogs-and-breeding/
    At Cuff we believe breed Presa Canario security dogs for performance, health and character. All of our security dogs are selected for guarding and protection
  12. Azz

    Azz Adminstrator

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    6JRT's likes this.
  13. Malka

    Malka Member

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    The dog in question was supposedly a pet, not a guard dog.

    And I very much doubt that the Cuff Group, who breed Presa Canario security dogs for performance, health and character, and as security dogs selected for guarding and protection, would sell one to two single women living together, each being a single mother with one child - who has another two dogs and leaves all three outside with no food or water for 45 hours while they go off to a bbq...

    ...unless, of course, the Cuff Group do not care to whom they sell their security dogs.

    Or maybe you know more than I do Tina?
  14. GsdSlave

    GsdSlave Member

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    I don’t think Tina was suggesting they got it from there merely that they used and sold them as guard dogs.

    Still it would be interesting to know what they did with their surplus stock and those dogs that didn’t meet the grade .?
  15. Malka

    Malka Member

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    I do not think she was but she had mentioned someone who imported those dogs before on this thread.

    And like you, I would be interested to know what they do with their "surplus" stock, having been reading their website.

    The dog that - sickening as it is to say so, has reported as - sorry, I cannot repeat what has been reported, did not come from a pet shop, that is for sure.

    Why did those two women own such a breed? I do not know the breeds of the other two dogs they owned.

    And why did they neglect it to such an extend that it did what it did?

    And, why mention a company who sells these breeds if they had nothing to do with this terribly horrific act?
  16. Azz

    Azz Adminstrator

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    I think many 'security' breeders sell dogs to anyone willing to pay the price tbh
  17. Malka

    Malka Member

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    Too many gimmee da cash and I ask no questions maybe...
  18. GsdSlave

    GsdSlave Member

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    [QUOTE="Malka, post:

    The dog that - sickening as it is to say so, has reported as - sorry, I cannot repeat what has been reported, did not come from a pet shop, that is for sure.

    why couldn't it have come from Pet Shop (superstores) there are a few ‘large ones’ that sell numerous breeds

    Why did those two women own such a breed? I do not know the breeds of the other two dogs they owned.
    There will always be people who want something ‘different’

    And why did they neglect it to such an extend that it did what it did?
    , sadly it happens every day to some poor dog

    And, why mention a company who sells these breeds if they had nothing to do with this terribly horrific act?[/QUOTE]
    at the end of the day they are a ‘business’ who are out to make money so most likely some will be sold on to the general public
  19. 6JRT's

    6JRT's Member

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    Azz likes this.
    Your Rocky was lovely Azz

    As for the security company they sell their puppies to anyone who phones up they will go in detail how they are trained from 8 weeks old & will be ready to pick up when the pups are 5-6 months old.
    There was a big out cry last year when they sold a pup to a well known dog fighter, it was splashed all over facebook.
  20. CaroleC

    CaroleC Member

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    It is possible that it might not have been purebred. We have all previously come across media 'shorthand' - describing dogs by the breed they most resemble, ie Pit Bull. The photo on BBC NorthWest News showed a light brindle sturdily built dog, but certainly not as substantial as Rocky, or the dog illustrated in Tina's post.
    The neighbour and the dogs have paid with their lives, a twelve month sentence, (which will actually be less), for the two women seems insufficient for the animal cruelty charge alone.
  21. Malka

    Malka Member

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    @GsdSlave

    So two young women, both single parents with children under 10, go into a "pet shop" [whatever fancy name you want to call it], hand over their money and come out with a dog that they then neglected until it ate a neighbour alive.

    And I suppose Harrods still sell lions as well.

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