Caution General Chat

Discussion in 'English Springer Spaniel' started by Gus and lulu, Apr 28, 2023.

  1. Gus and lulu

    Gus and lulu New Member

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    Caution

    Just had to put our beautiful springer to sleep at the age of 6 years because of a condition known as springer rage. When getting a springer, make sure the parents of the dog are present to see their temperment and personality.
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  3. CaroleC

    CaroleC Member

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    Toedtoes likes this.
    I am so sorry for your loss. It is distressing to lose an otherwise healthy dog for behavioural reasons. Rage syndrome seems to occur in several breeds and scans may fail to show what is happening - maybe the dog has to be on the machine at the right time.
    I have had an incidence of rage syndrome myself - 35 years ago and in a toy breed. My vet at that time believed that, where the dog was receiving sympathetic handling and training, these cases were likely to be due to either by brain tumours, or a form of epilepsy. Brain scanning is more advanced these days but I don't know whether this has led to any more recent theories. Certainly a dog displaying this trait should never be bred from.
    Did your vet give you any explanation for the behaviour? Did he do any brain scans?
  4. Toedtoes

    Toedtoes Member

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    CaroleC likes this.
    I'm sorry for your loss. May I ask if you had temperament issues with her since day 1? Or did it appear more recently?

    If since day 1 and you got her as a puppy, it is most likely bad breeding, or even just a bad breeder who didn't socialize the puppies.

    If it just came on suddenly, then I would hazard a guess it was a brain tumor or epilepsy, etc.

    Honestly, anyone buying a dog, at any age and whether purebred or not, should be making sure sure the breeder does all the health tests and breeds only those dogs who pass those tests, only breeds dogs with the appropriate temperament for the breed breed mix), AND properly socializes the puppies from birth.

    By 7-8 weeks, puppies should be interacting with the the people and experiencing every day things. Of course, they can't be around strange dogs, on grass, etc, but if they have been locked away in a kennel or crate that entire time, then even with quality parents you risk a fearful dog. And fearful dogs get the monikers "aggressive", "in a rage", etc, more often than not.

    The only dog I experienced with "rage" was a corgi mix rescue. She had been kicked, dragged, hit, etc, every day for years before someone her out of the home. When she came to me, if you tried to put a leash on her, she went into a "corgi rage".

    It took about 6 months, but I was able to put her back in control of her life - I let her attack the leash into submission when I brought it out for walks. I used a halti instead of a collar so she never felt a collar pulling on her neck. I basically removed every trigger from her life so she could learn to trust me. It did work. But it was a LOT of work and it really made me think before doing anything wither her.

    My Bat-dog had fear issues from a single event and in her later years, she started unexpectedly lashing out. It ended up being a brain tumor.
  5. Gus and lulu

    Gus and lulu New Member

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    Our vet had seen this before and actually had to put one of their own dogs down, a cocker spaniel, a few years ago and was certain as to what it was.
  6. Gus and lulu

    Gus and lulu New Member

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    Looking back, he started acting this way around 2 years old. We had 2 other springers at the time and 3 previously and this behavior was new to us. All the vet reports were complete when we got him and was a happy healthy pup but this condition appears out of nowhere and, from what we were told, is undetectable.
  7. Toedtoes

    Toedtoes Member

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    Two years old is when a dog "settles" into a personality. Before then, they tend to go through variations of a temperament as their hormones adjust. Think teenagers who finally calm down into a personality in their early twenties. That's why many problems don't show up until then.

    So that does lead to the potential that it was a bad breeding and/or lack of early socialization issue.

    Unfortunately, most people buy dogs/puppies and don't do research until they have issues. So advice like yours about checking the parents, along with ensuring health tests were done, etc, aren't seen in time by prospective dog owners. It's how puppy mills stay in business - people don't stop to think "how was this puppy bred" until after the purchase. So the mill gets the sale and therfore stays in business. And non-puppy mill breeders are the same. If they can sell the puppies without doing health tests, temperament assessments, early socialization, etc, then they will keep ignoring those things.

    And legally it is hard if not impossible to prove that a temperament problem that appears at 2 years is a direct result of bad breeding practices.
  8. Gus and lulu

    Gus and lulu New Member

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    Chalking it up to a painful and sad live and learn lesson, i guess.
  9. Helidale

    Helidale Member

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    That is all you can do but it hurts like hell to have to give up on an otherwise healthy dog. So much soul-searching and so many tears.
  10. Toedtoes

    Toedtoes Member

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    I agree. It is hearbreaking. And it really irks me that we conscientious dog owners have to face it due to bad breeders. It's hard enough facing this with a rescued dog, but when it's a purebred, there is just that knowledge that someone didn't care enough about the breed to do things right.

    I really wish the world would stop treating dogs as possessions and start treating them like they matter. It says something when we breed and treat Man's Best Friend as we do.
  11. CaroleC

    CaroleC Member

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    Chris B and Toedtoes like this.
    My boy was home-bred and his parents were two of the happiest dogs I have owned. His three siblings had normal happy temperaments, so I'm glad that if it had to happen, it was the one that I kept.

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